Your right GPTSM
I was characterizing the argument but it was not my intent for it to be interpreted as a characterization of the individual. Please accept my apologies.
Happy Guy :)
JoinedPosts by Happy Guy :)
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251
Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?
by booker-t ini must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.
i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.
fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.
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No JW kids at school today
by Jez inremembrance day today.
i work at the local highschool.
i was surprised to see only 1 jw kid in attendance at school.
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Happy Guy :)
I do not intend to leave the organization
I was not asking you to leave that cult.
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251
Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?
by booker-t ini must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.
i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.
fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.
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Happy Guy :)
Through one man sin entered the world and through another the basis for forgiveness of sin . Jesus was the perpetual sacrifice for sin and abolished the mosaic law covenant with his sacrifice for all mankind .
Why do you throw this line in? I fail to see where it has anything to do wth the issue at hand of whether Michael is Jesus. By throwing in some undisputed and unrelated statement is that supposed to now give strength or credibility to the Jesus and Michael discussion?
Either way, the house or rather should I say shack or shanty of an argument that Michael is Jesus seems to be built on a mound of sand. Requires reading things into the bible which don't exist, making dozens of assumptions and ignoring other aspects of the bible which are written. It strikes me as the same type of attempt that WT used to select dates for Armaggedon - reading things in the bible which aren' there and ignoring others which are just because they wanted people to believe there version. Why the desperate attempt with Michael and Jesus to do so when it seems so unimportant and unpivotol? Is it solely just to refute a trinity doctrine?
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HELP!! Trying to find right religion brough up as JW
by emmamess22 ini was raised as an on again off again (when convenient for flighty mom) jw.
i have recently decided due to the birth of a daughter that it was time to get it together and decide what to do with myself spiritually as she was going to church with her baptisit dad and i felt awful.
so, i've been using the reasoning book and reading the bible and trying to decide what's right.. spent hours looking at christmas online....saw it was traced to pagan celebrations and decided not to do it.
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Happy Guy :)
I don't think there is a "right" religion. I have no religion and I am perfectly content as I feel complete. I love my kids, I am kind to others and I do volunteer work for charities.
If I was in a position of needing religion in my life in order to fill complete, then I would try to find if there was one that was "right for me" as opposed to right. What is important to you in your life? What feels comfortable? and , Why the rush?
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Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?
by booker-t ini must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.
i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.
fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.
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Happy Guy :)
Thank you Sabrina for your response. It does not anwer my question #1 though. The fact that God did not dislose these things to Mary does not explain why the bible does not discuss this point.
Your second comment actually gives more evidence that Michael is not Jesus:
Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered 9 and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him 10 and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek.
Two reaons:
1. This does not answer my statement. Jesus expressed fear. If he had live for thousands of years as Michael he would have been very much looking forward to returning to Heaven
but more importantly;
2. "Once made perfect he became a sourse of salvation....." If he had been Michael then he would have oreviously been perfect for thousands of years. This is a good example of obtaining that status only for the very first time.
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No JW kids at school today
by Jez inremembrance day today.
i work at the local highschool.
i was surprised to see only 1 jw kid in attendance at school.
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Happy Guy :)
I just got tired of them trying to pressure me into doing things that I didn't want to do.
That's interesting because that is the same reason why so many people have left the JW cult.
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251
Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?
by booker-t ini must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.
i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.
fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.
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Happy Guy :)
Without trying to be facetious, that's just about the weirdest argument I've ever heard. The New Testament is full of partial quotations of passages from the Hebrew Bible, and Jesus in the gospels and Paul in his letters did it--often
By the same token and without being facetious I find your logic ridiculous. To suggest that Jesus did not really mean what he was saying that there was no meaning or depth to it but rather he was mindlessly attempting to regurgitate scripture without any actually meaning behind it is really reaching. The bible says that Jesus said this just before he died. It is a significant statement as it indicates Jesus' fear. Why would you want to deny that this happened?
It seems that so much of this argument of Jesus is Michael is dependant on pretending that the bible does not say many things that it actually does say and imagining that it says things that it actually does not say.
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Curious
by Shenneen ini just clicked in to see what was interesting.
i have also read all the discussions and comments that have been made.
i also have the feeling that there is alot of hate and disapointment in all your lives.
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Happy Guy :)
There are some who are bitter for the lies and deception and how it has negatively affected their lives from their years as JWs. One is going through a very difficult time right now as his ex recently tried to kill his children and one is in critical condition. There is alot of pain on this board as one might expect from people whose lives where touched by a cult. There is also alot of kindness and compassion here as people emotionally help eachother through the struggles of life. Struggles that occur naturally and struggles that occur by having to deal with broken families caused by a cult and shunning practices.
Many here have dealt with their pain and anger. Many are still dealing with this. There are some very nice people on this board and even though things get heated from time to time, the level of overall respect is impressive. I believe that is because the people here have had the strenght of character to come here and discuss these issues. This strength of character shows up in every thread and every day.
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Happy Guy :)
Happy Birthday SP
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WHY DO YOU INSIST on clinging to the Bible as anything other than fiction?
by Terry inhave you made the same effort investigating the history of how scripture was written down, compiled, redacted and selected as you did reinforcing your jw doctrines week after week at the kingdom hall?.
if you have; then you know it cannot be factual.. there have always been agendas.
the people with the agendas needed to wield power and using an invisible backup agent was a great device for controlling others.. somebody is always insisting they have an invisible and mysterious source of divine information and selling it like hotcakes and syrup.
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Happy Guy :)
"Well then that couldn't happen, if you were perfect already."
You should tell him that someone forgot to tell that to Adam and Eve when they purposely crashed their perfect teeth into the fruit.